Why Does My Subaru Use Oil?
Why Does My Subaru Use Oil?
For this article I am focusing on oil consumption and not external leaks from the engine, meaning if you check your oil, find it low, it’s not due for an oil change and there are no major visible leaks found with your engine, than this article applies.
If you’re a good car owner you DO periodically check your oil, I suggest every other tank of fuel, but it’s actually suggested by Subaru to do so every tank of fuel.
Why is this important? Over time the internal components of your engine such as the piston oil control rings, valve stem seals, valve guides and cylinder walls can all wear to the point where more oil is actually introduced into the combustion chamber than originally designed. This is a completely normal thing to happen in an internal combustion engine, and as long as the engine isn’t repeatedly ran low or worse out of oil, it won’t really affect the performance of the vehicle. As the engine ages it will reach a point where the piston oil control rings can no longer expand enough to slow the consumption of oil, the engine wears a little, every day you use it. Just like the more you walk in your shoes the quicker the bottoms wear out until one day your foot is wet, one day you will check your oil and it will be low where it hadn’t been before, this is the critical point in used vehicle ownership where staying on top of your maintenance aspects will avoid costly repairs, and not will mean a new engine. Some engines won’t use a drop of oil until the 2500 mile mark and then use a quart in a few hundred miles; this is mostly because of the dilution affect of the oil in the crankcase which I will address in a bit.
The key here is to know your car, and know the point at which it may use a little oil and stay on top of it! If you don’t check your oil how will you know if it’s low? Until the current era Outback limited models there has never been an oil level sensor on a Subaru. Prior to that Subaru used a low oil pressure light, but typically no oil pressure means the damage has in fact been done.
When I worked at the dealer we dealt with new Subaru vehicles that used some oil from day one, and unless it was more than a quart every 1000 miles there were never any warranty repairs authorized. As the internal combustion engine doesn’t achieve 100% combustion as its not 100% sealed it can never not use some oil as part of the combustion process.
Factors that can increase oil consumption are engines that don’t always reach operating temperature, vehicles that have “slow” front air fuel sensors or anything else affecting fuel trim allowing the car to have an excessively rich fuel mixture or problems with the 2 different crankcase ventilation systems. The flash point of your motor oil is one major factor in consumption the more diluted the oil is with unburned fuel the lower the flash point becomes, the easier it is for oil in the combustion chamber to be burned and head out the exhaust with the rest of the byproducts of combustion. What is supposed to happen is the un burnt fuel is designed to re enter the intake manifold and be part of the combustion process, but in order for that to happen the proper temperature must occur for oil vapor to separate from oil liquid. During the winter, stop and go driving and during short trips to the store this just doesn’t happen.
The key here is to be proactive and the more modern cars become the more detached we become of the simple everyday basic aspects of a car, the need to check the oil, the tires, the fluids and the bulbs will never really go away and while systems may be added to cars they are done with a price. An example of this is the low tire pressure monitoring system that adds about $500.00 to each new car now but was closer to $1000.00 just a few years ago.
You can have an engine that uses a quart of oil every 1000 miles and run like that for 300,000 miles as long as you don’t let it run too low repeatedly, or worse out of oil just once. Understanding your car is the only way to avoid costly repairs and life without your Subaru.
Pictured below is a piston from a 2.5l Subaru engine, the lower set of rings are the oil control rings and they are collapsed causing excessive oil consumption.
Subaru Piston and rings
Subaru Piston and rings
Thanks for reading, and check your oil!
Justin
Gospel!!
Very insightful article. Well said.
Thanks for your article Justin. Love your work!
My situation:
I have 2002 Outback 2.5l. roughly 140,000 miles. Head gasket was going and I found a guy who works on these subaru’s all the time do the repair. He replaced the head gasket by the removing the engine method, replacing all the seals and gaskets and reinstalling the engine at the same time. He also mentioned that the person who’d replaced my timing belt earlier had not replaced the components and that they would need to be replaced. He mentioned that he would only charge me the “cost of the parts” for the timing components – $400. All told he replaced the head gasket and timing components for $1900.
Engine ran fine for 90 miles. then the check engine light came on and I brought it back. It was the P0420 code dealing with Oxygen and he suggested that I probably needed a new Oxygen sensor or possibly a new cat.
code came and went for about 2000 miles and I started noticing the idle running low (possibly related to this Engine code I thought). then at about 2800 miles I started smelling weird engine exhaust (Very sweet and sickly). almost immediately I started hearing a clicking sound from the engine that appeared at > 2000 rpms . the next day driving it got louder and the engine just stopped running on the freeway.
I had it towed to the nearest station (not the guy who did the headgasket) and he said the engine was dry of oil and put in at least a quart.
I towed it back to the head gasket guy and he says it was a pin connected to the piston giving way and blowing the engine completely. He had given me a warranty on his work to 24000 and 12 months, but is suggesting that this wasn’t due to his work at all – since timing is still intact. He also said there was 3.25-3.5 of oil in the engine.
Two questions you can help me with for which I’d be eternally grateful – And obviously – I should have checked the oil more frequently than 2800 miles
1. assuming he’s telling the truth and there was only 3.25 in there (so actually I was running the engine at 2.25-2.5 or less)…what kind of damage would that do to the car?
2. Does any part of this story suggest that I should be asking for a warrantied engine?
3. Assuming I get the engine replaced – what should I be concerned with going forward in choosing an engine New vs rebuilt or used?
Thanks so much for you time.
John Sandahl
Hello John,
Your most likely not going to like what I have to say but it is your and your responsibility alone to maintain the proper oil, coolant and every other fluid level in your vehicle. The days of the “full service” gas station have long since been gone, but the need to check the engines oil level every time you refuel your car remains, its just now YOUR job as the market place decided the American consumer did not want to pay for a gas station attendant to check the car over.
I will tell you that you can go through life and never check your cars oil and most times you may actually never have a problem but every once and a while your engine will be low and when it is it must be corrected asap or damage will occur.
“1. assuming he’s telling the truth and there was only 3.25 in there (so actually I was running the engine at 2.25-2.5 or less)…what kind of damage would that do to the car?”
Not sure where these numbers are coming from ? Your Subaru 2.5l holds 4.3 to 4.5 Quarts of oil if none registered on the dipstick, it would have been approximately 2 quarts low on oil. 2 quarts works out to about 45% of the lubrication gone as well as 27% of the engines cooling system gone now as well.
So the engine runs hotter at a time when you have removed 45% of its ability to cool with lubrication and 27% of its ability to cool with fluid. The result is almost always going to be a damaged engine. It really works the same way a lawn mower does, if you run the lawn mower out of oil you do get out of mowing the lawn that day.
I suggest you check the oil on any car you own every 500 miles even if its new!! My 2012 Outback was delivered 1/2 a quart low on oil how would I have ever known if I didn’t check it?
The shop is correct in telling you its not a warranty concern, they have no control over what you do once the car leaves the shop, a head gasket failure and subsequent repair can sometimes create an oil consumption issue, but the fact that it uses oil wouldn’t have been a concern if the oil level was monitored and corrected.
If your cylinder heads are ok, then I would suggest a Reman Subaru Short block, if your heads are damaged I would suggest a used engine, that engine then resealed and after its installed the oil level checked every 500 miles.
I know you spent a lot of money repairing the car, if this happened to one of our customers we would offer to do the repair at a discount to try and help out, I would hope that the shop in question would offer the same.
I know it hurts the wallet and I do sympathize and I am sorry I cant offer more than the truth.
Justin
Great article. Do you recommend checking the oil on a subaru, when it is cold or after it has warmed up?
In my experience if I check the oil when the car is cold (I live in Colorado) after the car has sat overnight the dipstick reads low. However, if I check after driving the car has warmed up – the level reads somewhere below the low and full level. In general, it seems that the subaru dipstick is difficult to read.
Thanks!
Actually either way is fine as long as you know it expands when hot so dont be alarmed if it seems a little over filled. The Dipstick has a tendency to scrape the tube on the way out affecting the oil level readings at times.
Thanks
Justin
Hi Justin..
I’ve spoken to you before.. but this oil issue has me “up at night” ! I bought a used 2000 Outback 87K miles, that had just received the new head gaskets, waterpump, serpentine belt, valve cover gaskets etc.. The car runs like a dream.. I also replaced both front axles, and the converter… so most everything has been done to this vehicle to insure a good long life… The oil thing is weird to me.. using 5W30 here in the NC mountains.. I can never seem to get a good reading on the oil.. NO VISIBLE LEAKS, or drips.. But the car seems to be going through oil.. Took it on 600 mile trip to Florida (average 60-70 MPH) and checked the oil about half way through the trip while fueling, the reading seemed good. No sign of burning oil, no smoke or any external symptoms.. and when I arrived in Florida.. checked the oil when the engine was cold, again all is well.. My wife drove another 3 hours south and back and at that point the car was about 1/2 quart low…just below the F line on the stick.. She began the return trip to NC and about half way back checked the oil and the stick was “dry”… added 1 quart and then the stick read “F”.. Upon arrival at the house, I checked it again in the morning and the stick was reading super low.. I added another quart… Then took it to an oil change place had them drain it and count the quantity of oil coming out.. it was 3.5 quarts.. Which means that I had a quart and a half in the engine… Is that enough oil to safely run an engine on? Is it possible that my engine was damaged by heat BEFORE the head gasket job and I have internal damage? Would there be external symptoms if that were the case? Valve stem seals, rings? Are their symptoms to observe if those two things are in need of repair?
I’ve been told that valve stem seal replacement is about $1500 or so.. and if it is rings… to just get a new engine… because the ring job is more expensive than the car is worth… What do you say Justin.. any suggestions?
Thanks,
Bald Head
Hello Bald Head?
Based on the amount of oil you are going through its most likely worn oil control rings, if the car had overheated at all it will cause this to occur very quickly in some cases.
It means that you can either continue to add oil @ $whatever you pay a quart for the life of the car and as long as you continue to do so it will most likely run as is for very long time, or you can pay to have the short block replaced along with the heads rebuilt, yes the bill may come in higher than the perceived value of the car, but the 2 have nothing to do with each other.
Typically worn valve stem seals or guides will cause blue smoke on start ups after it has sat for a bit. That is one symptom you can look for, but even if you thought it was stem seals, I would suggest at least one piston comes out for inspection and clearance measurements during the valve stem seal replacement process to be safe.
Hope that helps
Justin
Your Independent Subaru Expert
Justin, thanks! about the following comment from you: “or you can pay to have the short block replaced along with the heads rebuilt, yes the bill may come in higher than the perceived value of the car, but the 2 have nothing to do with each other.” Does a replaced “short block”.. well, I’m not sure what that actually is or entails or costs… But would a new short block contain all the new valve stem, piston ring stuff you are talking about above? How much for something like this?
Bald Head
The short block is an engine block fitted with pistons rings crankshaft and bearings.
The cylinder heads would be removed form your Engine, rebuilt with new Valve stem seals, re worked valve guides and a re ground valves and seats.
I just put up a video that shows me in front of half of a cylinder block holding up a piston and showing rings if you need a visual here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZ8tT28MQYQ&list=UUe0tSf4w8giEP5n9kGhVAjA&index=1&feature=plcp
I have shot some footage showing a short and long block as well as Cylinder Heads but it will be a bit before I have done the editing and post it to you tube.
I don’t know how much a shop near you will charge, kind of like a house is more expensive in Southern California than Detroit.
If you want a shoot from the hip Number $3500.00 to $5000.00.
Hope that helps
Justin
Your Independent Subaru Expert
Also Justin, another question about the oil… in an engine with 88000 miles, like mine… When I change the oil how long would it generally take for that oil to start getting darker in color when I wipe the stick on a paper towel?
Justin!! It happened again today! I went out early in the morning to check the oil (55 degrees).. Just had the oil changed 1000 miles ago.. Check it this morning and the stick is DRY.. absolutely DRY! I checked it 3 times in disbelief.. Then went to the shop around the corner and put in a quart and a half.. and it was FULL on the stick… I’m going friggin crazy here with this car… What the heck? How can it be DRY.. and then add a quart and a half and it is FULL?
Bald Head
You have an oil consumption issue, and the Dipstick may be scraping on the tube while you remove it to check the oil level causing inconsistent readings.
Justin
I bought a subaru impreza 2.5i in 2010. right now it has 54K miles, but after driving it away from the lot with 30K, i checked the oil and it was about a quart low. i filled it up and just figured that the dealership didnt top everything off before i bought it. since then ive been religious about getting oil changes every 3-4K miles for the life of the car. the past two times ive taken it in, the check engine light and the cruise control lights have come on. both times, the dipstick was dry and they accused me of not checking oil as much as i should. the P0028 solenoid codes came up. but they cleared it, did the oil change and it never came back. i may have let it slip a bit, but had been checking every 1000K and adding a quart every 2500 or so or when i felt it was thirsty. so, while still under warrenty i got an oil consumption test at the dealership,just to try and rule anything out, and the results came back that i was 2.5 quarts low after 2154 miles driven. he said that normal oil consumption for subaru’s is 1 qt every 1200 miles. mine shows a bit more than that, however they said that they would “email the area rep and let him know what is goin on. will contact customer when we have more information.” they never did, and my car is not under warrenty anymore.
In my experience with subaru’s, ive always had to add oil, and while trying to sell the car right now for other reasons, its embarassing to show the maintenence records and oil consumption test, already having several people walk away from the deal due to fear of a head gasket issue or that my car is a lemon. I feel the car is immaculate and just that it burns oil and it is what it is. what can i rebuttle these potential buyers with when they get scared about oil consumption? thanks,
Its unfortunate to have to point this out, but you fell into the system and if you have repair orders to prove you and an oil consumption issue like that pre warranty expiration you have a case to make with SOA, but because you bought the car used, there is a good chance who ever had it before you was on the every year oil change plan. Subaru doesn’t have to do anything if thats the case and also if its documented you let the car run low on oil there is also typically no warranty coverage either, its one thing to use oil, another to let it run low on oil
You needed to follow up with Subaru on this if you have the afore mentioned documentation.
If not, thats a tough one to try and help with, many in our society dont want to be bothered with checking the oil so they dont, if you tell them they have to, they my not buy the car, but if your not honest that could be worse if the next buyer ran it out of oil right after they ought it form you.
If it was less than 1 quart every 1000k I would say you just need to find the right reasonable minded buyer but yours is right at that point where its tough to really say thats an ok amount of oil consumption.
I know you are looking for something different than what I have tried to point out, but all I have for you is the truth.
Hope that helps
Justin
Hi Justin,
I bought my 2006 manual Subaru Forester X at 52,700 miles in November 2011. It came with a 152-point check and a 60,000 mile warranty. I had the oil changed the day after I bought it. At about 54,700 miles, we noticed it needed a quart and 1/2 of oil. I mentioned it to the dealer when I returned for a mirror replacement. The service technician said the independent repair shop, where the oil was changed, probably did not realize how much oil the car required, and they didn’t use enough. OK, so I asked him to change the oil; mileage at that point was 56,500. At 58,500, it was a quart low again.
So, I’m at the dealer today, and the service technician said it’s typical for a Subaru to lose a quart of oil every 1,000 miles. She suggested an oil consumption test. I suggested that maybe it’s burning oil, or it may need a valve-job, or some other repair. Rather than leave today without an answer, at 59,991 miles, I asked to have the spark plugs replaced, at my cost of $235, so we could see if there’s oil where it should not be.
If it is true that Subaru Foresters require a quart of oil be added every 1,000 miles, I think that should be disclosed before the customer makes a purchase. I have essentially purchased a car that requires me to check the oil daily before I drive it – and to keep my car stocked with plenty of oil when I take longer drives so I do not blow up the engine or find myself stranded. My previous Subaru Forester XS was a 2003, and it never used oil between oil changes (not once). When it finally did begin to lose oil, the same independent repair shop diagnosed it as needing a valve job at approximately 140,000 miles. I loved that car, yet I do not feel safe in my new Subaru. Is this true that my newer car really can use a quart of oil every 1,000 miles? Or is it more likely that it’s burning oil, or needs a valve job? Since it’s still under warranty, I want to be sure of my options. Thank you! Ann
Have you ever experimented with using something other than 5w30 motor oil to address oil consuption? I have a 98 Outback with around 180k and tried 10w30 castrol high mileage but didn’t really seem to slow it down. What about synthetic, from my experience it seems like oil comsuption is worse with synthetic? I would love to hear what you think.
Thanks
Of course
We have used 10w40 Rotella oil in the 2.0l WRX to help with consumption, 10w30 in the DOHC 2.5 from 1995 to 1999 to help. Tried several different types of oil, grades and weights. If an engine is to the point where its worn and that’s the reason for consumption changing the oil type may not help that much, typically going to a 10w30 over a 5w30 works best when dilution of the oil is causing it to burn at a lower temp.
Justin
First and foremost, great article Justin!
My 2003 Forester is starting to use oil at 144k miles. Both head gaskets have already been replaced. I’ll be driving along and the low oil pressure light will flash on/off during a hard stop. Sure enough oil is low between normal oil change schedule. I commute on the highway 90 miles daily so engine definitely gets up to temp. I have not noticed any leaks so assuming the oil is being used/burned. I’m guessing the best course of action is to just check the oil level more often, keep it topped off (now with 10W30), and drive until the wheels fall off. Any additional thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated!
Thad,
I would try 5w40 at the next oil change, but please check the oil every tank of fuel from here on out, letting the light come on is a recipe for disaster and I would hat to see that happen just after you spent good money on a HG repair.
Justin
Thanks again Justin…will do!
I was hoping to get to 200k miles before having to get another vehicle so preservation is a priority.
Purchased a brand new subaru outback in 2010. Before it was a year old the engine blew. We were told it was a manufacturers defect and it was replaced on warrenty. Customer service was very helpful and gave me complete confidence in my subaru purchase. Well, the new engine is not quite a year old and we noted the the car was short one quart of oil after the sensor light came on. We returned to the local subaru service department and had to complete an oil consumption test. This took time out of my day on 4 occasions to sit and have the oil checked. The service department needs an education when it comes to customer service for many reasons, too many to list here. Following the oil consumption test we were told the oil loss was within normal specs for subaru. (1.55 qts of oil prior to 3600 mile oil change) Who would buy a car that will require the owner to check the oil between oil changes?? Why doesn’t the salesperson share that information prior to purchase? Between myself and my wife we’ve owned many different new vehicles and NEVER did we have to check oil between changes. Customer service is less than interested because “it’s in the book in black and white.” This car belongs to my wife and she has already been stranded on the side of the road with a blown engine, now we have to worry that it will happen again. We purchase a new car every 3 to 4 years and we made it clear to subaru we will no longer be subaru owners with the next purchase. Who in their right mind would purchase OUR car that needs constant attention to the oil. We are very disappointed. We made it clear to subaru that I don’t feel safe having my wife drive this car and we wanted out of this car and into a new car. (outback or legacy) Customer service said they have nothing to do with the purchase of new vehicles and did nothing to ensure we remained subaru owners. Subaru should be ashamed of themselves, my wife was already stranded on the side of the road once, and now we have to worry that it will happen again.
Hi Dan,
Sorry to hear there was an engine problem, that can happen with mechanical devices, good to hear it was covered under warranty and didn’t cost you any money. You are however talking about 2 separate issues.
To the rest, I sincerely hope you are partially joking about the unwillingness to understand that any car needs to have the oil checked in between oil changes? This is not a Subaru thing its on every car, fluid checks should be performed every other refuel on any car. I have tried obviously in vain to try and explain this to drivers, and we still have cars towed in with a blown engines with low oil levels as the cause. You have stated you never had to check the oil before, and to me that is just plain crazy talk, you instead chose to never check the oil. I can make a list a mile long of all the things I don’t want to do, or don’t think I have time to do, but that’s doesn’t discount the need for them to be done, by me or someone I pay to do it for me.
There is not a single car produced that is exempt from needing maintenance, every owners manual you will read will state the same black and white print about checking your oil! So if every company states the same thing are the car makers all crazy?
Some cars for a multitude of reasons will consume more oil than the one next to it in between oil changes, the important thing to understand is you need to learn how your car consumes fluids based on how you use it. An example of this would be if it used 1 qt after 1500 miles, well if you checked the oil every 600 miles or so you would see this pattern and know to add oil accordingly so you didn’t damage the engine. If you choose to not check the oil and the engine becomes damaged do to low oil, than you have no one to blame but your self. The dip stick is there to be used! The reason they call it an owners manual is that anything covered in the owners manual is information the OWNER needs to have and understand, the owners manual is not for the service department its for you!
If checking oil wasn’t important there would not be a dipstick ! You instead would just drain out the oil and put the capacity back in.
The issue here is that we used to teach very basic vehicle ownership in high school, this included checking the oil and changing the occasional flat tire, and we used to have service stations that checked the fluids and the air in the tires.
Now we have a society that is incapable of such tasks, and has to call AAA or the like to change a flat tire, or wont learn how to check the oil on their car. Every buyer of a new car now pays an extra $1000.00 for a car with the low tire pressure monitoring system because we don’t want to be bothered with checking the tire pressure. Do you not think $1000.00 would look better in your bank account and you could check the tire pressure?
By the way until the current platform Subaru never had a low oil level light only a its to late light. Subaru knows that the internal combustion engine is going to use oil especially at the higher oil change intervals they are pushing now, so now there is a low oil level light
If you dump your Outback there is ZERO guaranty that the next car wont require some of the same ownership requirements. Its nothing new, its across the board, and in part you should be asking your self why you think just the opposite of whats factual. All cars use oil, every single internal combustion engine uses oil! If you choose to not check the oil you are only ignoring the possibility that it could be low!
I honestly don’t know how long you have owned cars, or how you have gotten though this with out the importance of maintenance coming up before, only to say that you have accepted a different philosophy and that’s to always have a newer model vehicle, which I can understand and respect, but do have to point out that you could have just as had the exact same experience with any car. If you spend some time on any car Forum you will read stories like yours, it happens to all of them.
Today Toyota has been forced to recall over a 165,000 vehicles because of the floor mat getting caught up in the gas pedal again this time in the Flagship Lexus models. Would you have rather your Wife be in one of those vehicles?
I hope that which ever airline you choose to fly checks the critical fluids on the engines in between flights and doesn’t leave it to chance even though it doesn’t need to be serviced yet. I would hope if you ever went out to sea on a vessel that the oil level was checked even though it wasn’t due to be changed. Its the same thing with your car some one needs to check it!
As a married man myself that means I typically check my Wife’s 2005 Outback over every 2 weeks or so as I don’t intend to be part of the billions of dollars that are spent on Auto repairs that could have been avoided!
If you follow the stock market you will see the Auto parts, and Auto Repair related stocks have been on a multiple year run up with huge profits to match over that time frame. The reason for this is 2 fold, we have a aging fleet of vehicles (16.7 years is the current age of the average vehicle on the road) coupled with a real lack of understanding about car ownership, especially an older vehicle with higher miles. Billions are spent every year in this country on repairs that could have been avoided if people just took an hour to learn about their car, then another 5 minutes every 2 weeks to keep up on it! Thats what we are talking about 5 minutes!
I hope that wherever you land from here you have a better experience, but I also hope you will take a step back, a deep breathe and learn a little, so going forward a car that uses a little oil in between oil changes doesn’t get you so bent, as its bound to happen again over the course of the next 30 years.
I am sure you wont like my response to your post, but understand I am just trying to help you and anyone else that reads that somewhere along the the way a great number of us suffer from some disconnect about real vehicle ownership responsibilities.
The only reason your wife would be stranded on the side of the road with a low oil level casing engine failure situation, is because you didn’t check the oil and add as needed, surely you can understand that?
Justin
Jason,
What you are saying may be frustrating, but it is true. I’ve got an oil user.
I bought an Outback and a Forester, both new from the dealer. The Outback currently has 120,000, and the Forester 105,000. I do my own maintenance and change the oil every 3000 miles.
The Outback never requires oil between changes. The Forester was that way for the first 60,000 miles, then the consumption started. It now uses almost a quart every 1,500 miles. There is no apparent cause – no leaking, blue smoke, and as of today it has good leakdown numbers. It just uses oil, and it’s the only car I ever had to do so. There is no apparent cause and no mechanic or dealer to point a finger at.
In an ideal world I would not have to check the oil constantly and keep extra oil in the car. Cars are machines, and things happen to machines. Checking the oil level gave me a choice that those who ignore the oil don’t get. I was able to add $5 worth of oil and save myself a monsterous repair bill.
I’m not happy about the oil burning, but I’d be far more upset if the oil ran dry and it resulted in a $5000 repair bill.
Hi Jim,
With the Forester VS the Outback have you tried Castrol GTX 5w30 blend in the Forester to see if it makes a difference, sometimes the additive package can help prevent dilution. Also you can experiment with 5w40 oil as well.
I am glad you are proactive about your car, stay that way and you will be $ ahead of anyone that isn’t!
1 qt every 1500 miles does not however concern me, and I don’t want it to concern you at all either. Until an engine uses more than a qt every 500 miles it will most likely continue to function as designed for many many more miles to come.
Justin
I have a 2012 forester non-turbo with 13k miles that uses a quart of oil every 3k miles. the dealer says suburu says a quart every 1,200 mi. is normal. I don’t think it’s normal for any engine to use oil, especially a new one. this is my first suburu and I am very dissapointed.
Larry,
Well I understand you are entitled to your opinion, but facts are facts.
The internal combustion engine does not maintain a 100% seal, as such all of them will use oil regardless of who makes it. How much fuel collected in the crankcase determines the flash point of the oil lubricating the components in the combustion chamber, how you use the vehicle determines the amount of left over unburnt fuel that makes its way into the crankcase and if it will be evaporated as vapor or stay as a liquid thus causing dilution of the oil and flash point modifications.
There has not ever been, nor will there ever be, an internal combustion engine that does not use some oil, its factually not possible. Drivers of cars who have not studied this fact are welcome to from opinions but they are just that.
Perhaps a basic course in engines would be a good study, I would suggest taking the two engine courses offered at UTI (Universal Technical Institute) as a place where one may learn the facts, science and engineering behind what is not currently understood.
When I read comments like this I try to understand how we as a society have become so illiterate about the automobile. The difference between today’s car and the cars made in the 50′s is about safety, efficiency, cleaner emissions and a better stereo, but the basic principles of the automobile are still in place, brakes wear out, tires wear out, the internal combustion engine uses oil.
Where does any manufacture state the oil doesn’t need to be checked and that the engine doesn’t use oil? Who are we to tell all of the Automotive engine engineers that have gone to work on this they are incorrect. We cant achieve 100% ring seal because we have to allow for expansion, which is why the term “Ring Gap Specification” exists. Its like deciding one day that Gravity should no longer exist because we have evolved.
Engines that reach operating temperature and stay there will consume less oil than ones used for short trips, stop and go traffic, mountain passes or constant variable loads..
This is like the person who lives on a hill that they must come down multiple times a day complaining they didn’t get the mileage out of the brakes they expected to, because they used them in a way that caused them to wear quicker.
Subaru just built an AWD vehicle, capable for some owners of mid 30 MPG numbers for fuel economy, while maintaining a sound sense of gravity and a high crash rating, you want to complain about a few dollars in oil in between oil changes? I am sure somewhere out there their is a Lexus owner with a floor mat stuck on the gas pedal wishing they could trade rants.
We will most likely invent Warp Speed before we produce an internal combustion engine running on a derivative of liquid vapor petroleum that does not consume some oil.
Justin
Justin, I also have a 2000 Mercury Mountaineer with 150K that doesn’t use any oil between 5K mi. oil changes. My 2006 Toyota truck with 51K mi. doesn’t use any oil between 5K mi. oil changes. So why can they do it and Suburu can’t?
Larry, Larry Larry,
All engines use oil, get over it. Some at different intervals than others for a combination of factual reasons.
What if the Impreza ceases to use oil in between oil changes after 10,000 miles after the compression and oil rings have broken in and increased seal, Did you ever give that any consideration or are you again to busy complaining and ranting about a quart of oil to yet again take some time and learn about the facts of the internal combustion engine?
Telling me that “blank car” doesn’t use oil means nothing to me its like telling me a knife wound shouldn’t bleed because one time at band camp you were cut and it didn’t bleed.
Do Subaru a favor and trade it in on something else.
Go to any car forum and there are ALWAYS people complaining about oil consumption.
And Larry by the way here is a link for you http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/998660-excessive-oil-consumption.html
Its examples of just how many with the Ford Explorer and Mercury Mountaineer do in fact have the exact same issues you are here Ranting about with your Impreza even though your Mercury is magic.
Best of luck to you in your pursuit of the Perfect car.
Justin
Justin, your a retard all cars do not burn oil. My last honda civic I owned for over 12 years before a plow took it out in an accident, had 106k on it and DID NOT BURN not one once of oil….. My last bike zzr which oil was changed every year was NEVER low on oil at any point! For not only was I there for oil changes but there was a view point(glass) on side of crankcase.
Wow,
Did you really just call me retarded?
Ummmm.
Here is a question for you Sir, if cars or lawn mowers for that matter didn’t use oil why would it have a place to check it? Why would every Owners Manual since the invention of the internal Combustion engine warn about the importance of checking oil? Just for fun I bet.
Running 12 years on the same engine oil is just amazing I tell you, I sure hope you sent your story into Ripley’s Believe it or not. Gee Golly Gosh, if you’re Bike never used oil and had a perty little glass to see it in, why Ever change it?
ALL Cars use some oil, some real early, some not until 10,000 miles but ALL do! Its a matter of Math, Science and these things called facts of the internal combustion engine. Next you will tell me they don’t need no fuel neither I bet, cause you never once put gas in your Honda.
Telling someone cars don’t use oil and than watching they’re flat out financial devastation when presented with a $5,000.00 engine replacement bill is nothing I would ever suggest to another Human being. I instead will let them know cars can and will uses oil, if you stay up on it you won’t blow it up any true industry professional will try and do the same thing.
All I try to do is help Car Owners avoid blowing an engine because the oil level is low and for that you think you can call me a retard.
Sticks and Stones may break my bones, but your words could have made me more stupid, for having to have read them.
But because Mama said if you don’t have anything nice to say, then don’t say anything at all I will leave it there.
Justin,
Thanks! Castrol GTX 5W-30 happens to be what I’ve been using. I’ll see what 5W-40 will do for it and report back in 6 months.
I have a 2006 Subaru Impreza Outback 2.5 non turbo which did not have an oil consumption problem until I had the head gasket replaced by the dealer at 58,000 miles. Overnight it developed an oil consumption problem. It uses 1 quart every 1200 miles. How did this happen?
Hi Kris,
That can happen sometimes. Only way to know the cause is tear down and inspection, anything else is just guessing.
Justin
I have a 2007 Outback 2.5 non turbo, just had the head gasket repaired at 89k and now it’s doing the same as yours, about a quart every 1500 miles. I would love to know what happened, as well because it wasn’t an issue before. Taking it back to the dealer that supposedly fixed it in the first place on Tuesday. Not hopeful at all.
Sounds like Suburu has build a faulty engine, since no other vehicle I have uses a drop of oil between 5K mi. oil changes. One has more than 150K miles. There is something wrong with a brand new engine that uses any oil. I am very dissapointed in my Suburu!!!!!
My brand new 2012 Impreza burns Oil. The Low Oil light turns on every 3000 km. Why do other Imprezas not burn Oil, while mine, and a few others I have found in forums do? Also, after Subaru fills back up my oil, the low oil light doesn’t turn off. They have to restart my computer to make the light turn off. What do you think?
The oil consumption may Improve as the engine breaks in and the ring seal improves.
As far as the light reset, it can be driven and it will reset on the next start up after a long drive, without resetting the Module.
Justin
Justin
Sorry I left some important information out. My car is currently at 19000km. The low oil light has now turned on 5 times. Should I still consider this a break in period?
Justin,
Thanks for the article.
I have a question. On June 19th my 2008 subaru impreza with 52,000 miles on it, had a right cam seal leak. My car stalled out and was smoking. The techs told me there was no other damage from the leak. 3 weeks later my car died once again and I was told that the right cam shaft was crakced. They fixed that and some valves. One month and 1900 miles later, my oil light goes on and my oil dipstick is dry. They put in 5 more quarts of oil and tell me I have to do the oil consumption test. Does this seem right? Do you think I really need an oil consumption test when the car has obvisouly gone through more than a quart/1000 miles? Thanks!
One more thing, they did rule out a leak but where would 5 quarts of oil go??
HI Nicole,
Im struggling to answer your questions here because of the following.
The cam seal leak wouldn’t have caused it to stall, the cam shaft wouldn’t have cracked either.
The car doesn’t hold 5 qts of oil.
There is either some terminology misunderstanding, exaggerations or flat out lies occurring, from here I just cant know which.
I would start with reaching out and obtaining a better understanding from the shop of exactly what has transpired.
Justin
Justin,
Hi, thanks for responding. According to my paperwork this is exactly what is happening. The subaru dealership put in 5 new quarts of oil. I am in process of the oil consumption test. I have driven 500 miles and the oil is at the low level on my dipstick so now I will be bringing it back in for the fourth time.
I have been dealing with two subaru dealerships which has not been fun. I have been told from one dealership that the camshaft cracked due to the oil leak problem. The other dealership told me it could have been from bad handling when the cam seals were replaced. I appreciate your responding. I think if my engine is not replaced at this point its time to get rid of the car!
Hi Nicole,
I dont often do this, but im concerned here.
If you are willing to email service@allwheeldriveauto.com with copies of all of the invoices and notes from your visits with this ordeal, I would like to help you get some resolution. I would need to compile all of the history and try to put the pieces together and then I can make some suggestions.
Justin
Thank you, Unfortunatley I do not have a scanner to upload the invoices. My local dealership has the invoices right now as well. I dropped the car off for the fourth time last night and Im still waiting to hear what it will be this time. Thank you for your concern!
I purcased 2012 Subaru Impreza and within a month the oil light came on. Had oil changed and required 5 qts. The oil light is constantly coming on and like always quart low. I service it on regular basis and just 2 wks ago dealership topped it off and it is quart low again and still no answers. I find it ubsurd that if this is normal you are not made aware at time of purchase. This car was bought for my daughter who is in college and im very frustrated. I have had several cars and have never had to put oil in between changes. I feel that Subaru is avoiding the issue and never really explaing why. Unhappy customer and will never buy another Subaru. Im sticking to Chevrolet.
Hi Julie,
If its using more than a quart every 1000 miles than there may be a mechanical issue that Subaru needs to warranty, but your not giving me any specifics, just stating it happens all the time, which would indicate it comes on every time you drive it?
Google “oil consumption problems Chevrolet” and see what you think. Its not that I am trying to bash Chevrolet, quite the opposite.
When I wrote this article it was to try and help explain why an internal combustion engine may use some oil in between oil changes, what has come out of it both in responses to this article, the low oil level light article and emails sent directly to me is that many just want to complain rather than understand.
Ive posted this same thing in this thread, please read it.
1. Your 2012 Impreza may consume less oil and obtain better fuel economy after it is broken in, the break in period of the 2.0l with the CVT transmission appears to be much greater in length than in previous models due to the lower RPM range the engine is kept in the utilize fuel economy.
2. There is a section in the owners manual that covers the break in procedure and ho often to check the oil, please give it a read, the manual is not just there to take up space in the glove box, its there to help you understand your car, having statements in black and white in the owners manual (written by the very people who made the car) contradict an opinion you have fostered may help you understand your opinion could be incorrect.
I remember when I went from owning a blackberry device to my fist Iphone, and how inconvenient it was that the battery just didn’t last very long, it actually seemed inexcusable that a $600.00 phone constantly needed to be charged, I mean why couldn’t Apple do any better, you shouldn’t need to charge your battery all the time, who would do that? Its after forming that opinion that I needed to realize the 1st Iphone did so much more than the Blackberry in 2007, that now it makes sense and while its still inconvenient to need to charge the phone daily, its now just a part of life for any Iphone, Android or Windows phone user. There are things you can do to limit battery consumption in your phone, and there are things you can do to limit oil consumption in your car, some users wont have to make any adjustments at all, some will need to alter how they go about the daily use, or keep things the same whilst understand whats required in order to obtain good use.
Subaru had a break though with the 2012 Impreza, they were able to obtain Fuel economy over 30MPG in a symmetrical AWD, 5 star crash rated platform while still maintaining similar pricing to the platform before. Yes it does appear that for some there are unindented consequences such as having to top off the oil once a month or so, and this “event” stays around for some and goes away for others.
My advice is usually to never buy the first year of a new model or a refresh of a current model, as there are always bugs. Subaru is a good company, the Impreza is a safe and reliable AWD vehicle and I am sorry if its potential maintenance needs are to complex. I do really want you to understand that this can and will happen to other cars you own, for every Chevy owner that never used a drop of oil, there is one that consumed 2 quarts in between oil changes and they hated that Chevy until they traded it in on a Subaru.
Justin
Hi Justin,
Just wanted to share the oil consumption figures of my subaru and other family member subaru’s.
my dad’s 2006 outback 2.5i uses 1 quart every 2,000 miles and it has 235,000 original miles
EJ253
my mom’s 2004 Outback 2.5 uses 1/8 quart of oil every 3,000 miles. 85,000 miles and a LOT of piston slap. EJ259
my 2005 Impreza RS uses a quart every 2,000 miles with 94,000 miles. EJ253
The way i look at it, people who dont get involved with their cars lose out on LIFE. Heck, my dad’s 2006 Outback has 235,000 miles. it owes us NOTHING, all it asks for is a little oil here and there. Im amazed at how quiet the engine is and how well it runs and drives. If people are too ignorant to check their car’s fluids, keep up on maintenance and complain about oil consumption, they shouldnt be driving at all.
Wow Matt!
Thanks for posting that information, I hope readers find it useful.
Justin
Justin,
First, thank you for your article and intelligent comments.
My wife and I own a 2012 Outback 3.6R we purchased in March, new, and it is our first vehicle with a boxer engine. It currently has ~14K miles on it. Aside from the several initial service related issues with the selling dealer, we like the vehicle very much. (SOA remedied our issues, and we are about to go to a new dealer for our next service.) We have a 45K maintenance agreement for synthetic oil, etc, and the service interval is 7500 miles. We have owned a variety of cars over the last 40 years, and, with no exception, by 1989, our new cars were not burning noticeable amounts of oil(a quart or more per 3500 miles); some we kept over 200k with less than a quart per 3500 miles. We did have the initial oil changed at 1K, and have used synthetic in our vehicle since 1998. And we were, and remain, religious about checking and changing the oil regularly. When we thought we had gone through a quart in 3K and discussed this with our selling dealer, he told us 1 qt per 1k is ok. I found that ridiculous, but Porsche apparently says about the same thing. I like your explanation about breaking the engine in and checking consumption afterwards makes sense. And, perhaps this is why Subaru has you do the initial oil change at 3K. But, I would like to think that a modern, well designed, relatively high compression engine would not consume noticeable amounts of oil. (Your points fully understood about cold runs, stop and go driving etc.) So, my question to you: is there something unique about the boxer engine that increases/can increase oil consumption?
Thank you in advance,
Shawn T.
Hello Shawn,
Its always impossible to deatil every aspect of what can cause the issue, but ill try to sum up the most common or most likely reasons.
The internal combustion engine at this time does achieve 100% efficiency, meaning not al of the fuel used in the combustion chamber is burnt, the unburnt fuel then mixes with the oil where the oil slowly becomes diluted over time lowering the flash point of the oil entering the combustion chamber to lubricate it, the oil is now ignited with the air fuel mixture and thus burnt and exited out of the tail pipe.
While its true that this can and will happen to any engine, things that can make it more pronounceable on the “H” engine design are the fact that the excess fuel entering the combustion chamber at “shut down” will dilute the fuel much more so than in a inline engine. Then it takes a specific temperature event for the liquid fuel now mixed with the oil to turn into vapor and makes it way out of the crankcase via the PCV system. So yes an H engine used for lots of short trips, will use more oil than one that is run on the highway at speed.
Oil consumption and compression do not have that much to do with another as its the oil control rings that help determine oil consumption, rather then the compression rings alone.
Enter the the new Impreza that has achieved better fuel economy with the smaller engine, and CVT transmission. Part of the design is to keep the engine at a lower rpm, thus using less fuel but also creating less energy in terms of thermal values, allowing the engine to technically run cooler in the combustion chamber over a given amount of time. This is why here have been a few complaints, and there will most likely continue to be some. I think the fuel economy improvements, and safety ratings out weigh the cost of a few quarts of extra oil in a year, but to each their own I guess.
For the record, I own a 2012 Outback H6 that is my daily driver, my commute is anywhere from 5mph to 60 mph for 45 minutes each way, as such this is an extreme way to use the car and I change the oil every 3000 miles with the Synthetic blend oil. It will be any where from 1/4 to 1/2 of a quart down at that time typically. It doesn’t start consuming oil typically until it reaches the 2500 mile mark, unless I get to stretch its legs out on a trip over the mountains for the weekend, we have not yet owned it through a full fall and winter season so it will be interesting to see if the oil consumption changes a bit with the lower air temperatures.
Hope this Helps!
Justin
Thank you for the response, and yes it helps. I plan to continue with the full synthetic and will report back what consumption we see. I am interested in seeing how our vehicles compare over time. We rive ~ 50 miles per day if commuting (and at an almost steady 40=55, with minimal stop and go.) It is also our “mountain car” taking us away on weekends. As mentioned, we have burned some oil over the last 5800 miles; looks like~ 0.5 quart. Good luck with your Outback.
Again thank you for the discussion.
Shawn
BTW: this is one of the best car sites I have come across!
“I think the fuel economy improvements, and safety ratings out weight the cost of a few quarts of extra oil in a year, but to each there own I guess.”
It’s out weigh, not out weight.
The expression is “to each his own.” If you want to bastardized the English language and have the subject singular and the object plural by writing “to each their own,” then at least write “their,” which refers to a person, not “there” which refers to location. My 10 year old could do better.
I could write similar critiques of your every post. You are proof that the blogosphere is an opportunity for every moron who failed 5th grade English to become a writer.
Internal combustion engines are not that complex, so I don’t know if you’ll be able to manage grammar, but give it a shot. There is great satisfaction is a well turned phrase.
Hi Sam,
While I do appreciate you taking the time to let me know about a couple of grammar or spelling errors you have come across, the manner in which you appear to think you can go about it, leaves a lot to be desired.
You know nothing of me or my edumacation level, if you would like to take the time to critique everything I’ve posted about here, feel free but it does point to how sad your life must be.
My excuse to grammar or spelling mistakes is that I am always in a hurry, there just is not enough time in the day to run two businesses, be a Scout leader, father, husband, friend and then try and Hep Subaru owners across the globe. Many times I post from a IOS device, perhaps you have heard of auto correct? I can painstakingly proof read each post I make, or try and respond to another Subaru owner that has a question and needs help, I care much more about helping everyone that needs some advice over helping less but making sure my grammar is up to your standards at all times. The very small amount of money the site generates is just enough to cover the hosting and expenses with having it, so an editorial department is just not in the works for now.
I am not a blogger, I started trying to put information out about common Subaru problems to try and help people get more out of their Subaru and avoid costly mistakes, its called helping. Cost for that help ZERO, but you may have to put up with the missed capital letter here, or the wrong use of an adjective there, or put up with any other of my many shortcomings. But you may learn a little something about your car if you choose to. I get satisfaction out of helping people, thats why I do this, I am not writing poetry or a novel or even a news story. If you believe information about a Subaru is somehow less worthy of your read, if a there is used in place of a their, or the mistake of weigh being turned into weight because autocorrect deemed it so and I did not catch it from the 4 inch screen of my Iphone then or than by all means please go to the other site where the Subaru guy is helping thousands of Subaru owners across the globe, I am sure he is much smarter than I. So why not a hey Justin your use of this word here is wrong, or I think that sentence should be phrased like this. We used to try and help people in this country, it’s part of what has made our history so great and every time I come across those that would berate rather than use their knowledge for the betterment of their fellow man and find out you’re a parent I worry about the future
Next its your right to form an opinion about somebody you have never met, or had a conversation with but it does actually point to your potential narrow-mindedness and shortcomings when you decide to try and belittle someone over a grammar error.
I have a rule with this site, if you post and your are nice you will get a nice reply, in fact there really is no limit in how far I may go to try and help you out of a dilemma. If you post here and your are disrespectful, hateful or ignorant about the subject, you will get a less friendly post.
To someone like yourself, there just Ain’t much I can say other than, the time I have spent in response to you is time taken away from somebody much more deserving and I apologize to them in advance. I’d much rather answer a question about a Subaru issue than defend why I may have made a error in grammar. No I didn’t have to allow your post but reading it while on a family vacation struck a nerve.
Good luck to you in your pursuit of the well turned phrase.
Sincerely
Justin
When I read this comment, my only thoughts were that “Sam Clemens” is talking about himself.
1. His name probably isn’t really Sam Clemens, he calls himself that because “the blogosphere is an opportunity for every moron who failed 5th grade English to become a writer.”
2. “… If you want to bastardized the English…” Speaking of which, it should be bastardize not bastardized.
3.”There is great satisfaction is a well turned phrase.” How about “IN ” instead of “is”? Satisfaction IN a well turned phrase is more satisfying than any satisfaction received from your sentence.
4. This forum is about subarus, not grammar. Even a simple mechanic like myself thinks someone making grammatical errors while trying to correct someone elses grammar is worse than a mechanic being a good mechanic but making some grammar errors.
While Samuel Langhorne Clemens could turn a phrase, I think a quote from George Herbert may be appropriate: “Whose house is of glass, must not throw stones at another.”
Hi Mike,
Thanks for the post!
Hey Justin,
Just reading all your responses to oil burning, You know your stuff it sounds like. You mentioned ” dilution of oil”..at 2500 miles full and I drove a few hundred and dry. I couldn’t believe what I was reading. The EXACT thing has JUST happened to me. I have a Subaru Outback automatic 2.5 2000. I have had the HG and all the gaskets replaced along with timing belt, water pump, etc. $ 2250.00 AND I put in a tranny ( used) with 49,000 miles on it. The car is great. I really love it. Enough history. Oh purchased in September 2009 with 135,000. I was wondering that if I changed the oil every 2000 miles and filter, would that greatly reduce the ” dilution of oil” ?
I appreciate your time and expertise. Its hard to find a tech/mechanic that knows ” his stuff”
sincerely
Michael
Hello Michael,
I think I would start by trying a different oil. if you are not already using Castrol GTX 5w30, I would try that for one service interval and go from there.
You could change it at 2000, but topping if off with a quart or two may be a less expensive option for you.
Really knowing how your car “behaves ” and staying on top of it is really whats important.
Hope that helps
Justin
Thanks Justin,
Couldnt agree more with “knowing your car”
I am using that but substitute a quart of marvel mystery oil.
I will change and not put in marvel oil.
Thanks again for your response.
Michael
I currently have a 2013 impreza and and am getting another. In terms of oil consumption yes your car will consume oil until about 10000 miles then consumption should level off to a trackable number. Most people are angry because they bought into the cost of ownership formula. People buy cars these days expecting not to spend money on them or they simply just beat the snot out of them without any regard, thats a good reason why I avoid used cars like the plague these days. Maintaing a car is not that difficult and as for oil changes we are simply arguing over this formula. On severe service you supposedly change oil every 3750 on regular service you change it 7500: first problem variable what service are you on, everyone always picks normal service why I have no idea. If you drive 15k on severe service you will have 4 oil changes, on regular service you will have 2 oil changes. Assuming you wouldn’t have to even top off the oil on the normal service is also not reality ditto for the fact that you might want to change the oil filter around 5k. So we are arguing about 2 oil changes so less than $100 for a car that costs over 20k. The oil will get diluted no way around that. If you believe subaru cars are unique to the oil burn allow me to steam roll that notion with a honda example. I had 2 hondas an 09 accord and 10 civic, If you were to go to carcomplaints.com or google you would see that they both consume oil just like a subaru, there is even a fun lawsuit. But wait even if you go further back you will see that, how about 2003 yep burns oil. Every car burns oil, you might not notice it but they do to some degree. Aluminum engines also tend to burn oil a bit due to nature of the material, RPM of engine also influences oil burn, redlining burns oil, vtec burns oil.
The life blood of most machines is oil, change them often this applies to transmission as well. Why the entire galaxy is buying into the total cost of ownership models is beyond me. When you buy a car new or used, you have to invest money in it for it to remain functional. Don’t drive with bald tires, change your fluids, get an alignment, change your brake pads, if you value your life maintain your vehicle because if you don’t you are opening yourself up to a world of hurt.
just my 2 cents
Well Said John!
Thanks for posting, and congratulations having a clear understanding of how a car works, you are a breath of fresh air to me.
Justin
“Factors that can increase oil consumption are …. vehicles that have “slow” front air fuel sensors or anything else affecting fuel trim allowing the car to have an excessively rich fuel mixture or problems with the 2 different crankcase ventilation systems.”
Would this make the car smell a bit like gas in the engine bay and in the vents, especially when coming off the freeway?
Any help is appreciated!
If its a raw fuel smell like pumping gas than no not typically, If its a stronger than normal exhaust smell than yes the exhaust may have excessive emissions.
But if the smell is in the engine bay its most likely a small leak.
Justin
I just purchased a 2013 Outback in late October 2012 with the four cylinder engine. I put gas in weekly and thus check the oil weekly, usually on Saturday mornings. I have 750 miles on the car and so far the oil level is still full. As I understand it, the 2013 come with synthetic 0W-20 from the factory and the FB25 requires synthetic oil.
I have been driving for more than fifty years and yes all engines do consume some oil. The type of oil used is also important. I have been using synthetic oil since the early 1990′s and have never had an engine failure or an issue with oil consumption. I am however concerned with the year round use of a 0W-20 and will consider going to a synthetic 0W-30 or 5w-30 when the weather gets warmer.
Hi John,
Thanks For Sharing
I am currently looking at buying a new vehicle and really like the looks of the new 2014 Forester,features and of course Subaru’s AWD system BUT I am concerned with how many people are complaining about high oil consumption with Subaru engines even the new FB engine.
Is the design of the Boxer engine what causes the oil consumption? Also I’m sure that the recommendation of Subaru to use synthetic 0W20(which is like water)just magnifies the problem. I realize that some engines of all manufacturers can use oil due to various reasons but it seems if you look at all the posts in the various Subaru sites that on the whole, Subaru engines use oil.Some guys have owned 7 or 8 Subarus and they all have used oil. I have owned 7 GM vehicles and I didn’t have to add a drop of oil inbetween oil changes(3000 mi)on any of them. On one of the Subaru owner’s website, an owner of a 2012 Forester posted a page from the owner’s manual that said if oil consumption rate seems abnormally high after the break in period, for example more than 1 quart per 1200 miles, contact your Subaru dealer. So what Subaru is saying that up to 1 quart is considered normal? They are basically telling you that it is normal to use this much oil. IT ISN’T. Also putting an oil level light now on their vehicles is almost like they are conceding that the vehicle is going to use oil. I have read about new Subaru owners who are disappointed after buying a new Subaru and experiencing excessive oil consumption after driving an older vehicle that had over 200,000 miles and didn’t use oil in between regular oil changes(3000 mi). Since you work on alot of Subaru vehicles maybe you could comment on what percentage of Subarus use oil. Thanks.
“IT ISN’T”
Says who?
Every Owners manual you will read regardless of make, model, year will tell you to check the oil, typically every tank of fuel. But thats probably just for fun right?
Do some real research, head over to any Car owners Forum and read post after post of drivers whining about high oil consumption in every make on the road. If you are unable to find another current model Vehicle with oil consumption issues, you just ley me know and Ill sned you some links, this is not a Subaru Issue it just happens to be the car your researching right now.
There are many variables in oil consumption, I’ve tried on this site to explain why it can occur in articles, and follow up posts to questions. Ive also stated this on this website, the new Fb engines seem to use some oil and not get the expected Fuel economy right away, I believe its the lower RPMs the engine is now running in for better fuel economy and less expansion form heat and pressure as a result resulting in longer break in periods and higher concentrate of oil dilution. Many local customers have gone through this and then the economy went up, and the oil consumption down.
Before I made my Mother Buy here First Subaru in 2006, she owned two Gm Vehicles, a 1997 Pontiac Sunfire and a 1985 Buick Century. Both used oil, both had steering rack replacements before 60,000 miles one had a water leak, that lead to mold, the other had an alternator catch on fire! The Sunfire had lots of ignition related issues, and left my Mom Stranded more than once and it was Subaru Tech Son to the Rescue until I said enough.. My Sisters Honda was ran out of oil with 500 miles left to go according to the Sticker and was all of three years old, My brother in law had a Toyota Camry he happily traded in for his 2002 Subaru Impreza Wagon with almost 200k and counting that does use a quart of oil in between oil changes and has had the head gaskets replaced at 60,000 miles by my shop. I point these out as they are some of my Experiences, and in the same way you wish to use your own I would like to use a few relevant examples of family members who made the switch to a Subaru mostly because I forced them to, because I wasn’t working on their junk anymore.
So when I read my so and so cars never used oil all I can say is great! But you know what? That doesn’t mean that none of them did!
As far as percentage of Subaru’s that use oil, 100%. Some after 1500 miles, some not until 10,000 miles because of a long list of factual atributes of the internal combustion engine combined with the variable of different types of use, climate etc.
If you are somehow reading into oil consumption as a lack of engine building prowess, you can spend much more money on a BMW and still have that car use oil. Dont take my word for it, Google, BMW Oil Consumption, just for fun.
Justin
Hie Justin,I have a 1998 Subaru Forester with turbo.Every time the turbo is on boost it makes a unsual sound that is irritating,and also when the turbo starts to spool the car starts to jerk over and over and for now my car dosen’t have it’s normal power.I hope your answer will help thanks.
No ideas, without seeing the car, and the car you have was never sold in America so I am still at a disadvantage.
I recognize that all cars consume oil and I check my Subaru oil with great frequency, but Subarus consume ridiculous amounts of oil compared to every other car I’ve owned. I’ve owned Hondas, Mercedes, Volvos and none of those vehicles ever had oil levels drop significantly between oil changes. I had a Honda Civic with 200,000 miles on it and it would never burn more than a 1/2 qt. Regardless of whether or not we need to check oil regularly, when the dipstick constantly reads “full” we get lazy. Both my parents have Mercedes and they never check the oil [I'm not saying that's right] because it’s never low – ever. If my parents switched to Subaru tomorrow, they’d be screwed.
I have a 2007 Subaru Impreza SE [43,000 miles] and I am very careful about maintenance. The dipstick is indeed horrible on this car, which is strange b/c the dipstick is the *most* important component of a Subaru. Every 1200 miles, I have to dump in a quart of synthetic [Mobil 1 5W30]. I completely understand that a car owner must religiously check their oil, but in reality, most people don’t. Subaru NEEDS to educate people about this. I don’t know anyone who checks their oil like I do. In most cars, this isn’t a problem, but in a Subaru, not checking your oil will in fact lead to a costly engine replacement – in short order. In the 10 years I owned a Honda Civic, I never had to top-up the oil and I abused that car to no end. In my Subaru, which I lovingly maintain, I need to pour at least 3 qts of oil into it between changes! Not only does my Subaru have the milage of an F350 Crew Cab, I now have to dump $30 of synthetic into it between oil changes!!!
Again, I realize all cars consume oil, but I’ve never owned or heard of a car that consumes this volume of oil – at least a car that’s supposedly within spec. It’s not what I would consider normal. None of my friends’ cars use that kind of oil between changes. When I sell this car, I’ll have to get the next owner to sign a caveat b/c they’d surely destroy the engine if they didn’t check the oil with great frequency.
Hi Mike,
Im just going to point out a few things here.
So Here is the thing, even though YOU never had any oil consumption issues with any other car you have owned, that doesn’t mean the model did not use oil for anyone else. Not every 2007 Impreza uses oil, yours does.
As far as Subaru Educating people its in the Owners manual, I know no one reads it but its there in black and white, and guess what its in every owners manual for virtually every car, ever made.
Some how drivers in this country have become ignorant about the basics of car ownership. Here are the keys no go drive.
If you own a car that uses oil it a POS no matter what brand it is, but if you think oil consumption is just a thing Subaru invented, um no. Google any model followed by oil consumption and please report back with the ones that never showed up, I promise Honda, Mercedes, Volvo and an F350 will not be on that list.
The mileage of a 2007 Impreza is in the low 20′s, that’s great if your F350 gets that kind of mileage as well thanks for pointing that out as it will help make my next point. An AWD vehicle has more drive train load than a 2wd or part time 4wd vehicle, the reason the Subaru may use oil is the same reason it may use gas. The newer Impreza is capable of 30 mpg in a AWD platform.
You never mentioned oil change intervals, so I can only assume since you use Mobil One you are trying to change the oil less often than needed, not understanding dilution and consumption, next have you ever given the thought you should switch to the oil Subaru recommends and see if the oil consumption goes away or diminishes? Has anyone graphed the data from the front air fuel sensor, inspected the PCV valve, checked the wheel alignment, or maybe just the tire pressure.
I would strongly suggest Castrol GTX 5w30 blend changed every 3000 miles or at least for one oil change to see if it improves, I would never use full synthetic oil on an engine that is consuming oil, as synthetic oils while better at lubrication are not necessarily better for the potential dilution factor and burn away as a result. We have actually found that a Full synthetic oil, unless moving up to say a 10 w 40 will burn away quicker than a blend or conventional in many situations especially at lower temps.
Justin
Thank you Justin for your response. Some good info there.
A few points in my defence:
1] Since new, my 2007 Impreza SE has been using Castrol GTX 5w30 @ 3000 mile intervals. It was burning through that so after some research, I decided to try synthetic. Still no change. So, given your advice, I might carefully switch back, b/c synthetic oil is so expensive in Canada [$50 for 4.4 litres of Mobil 1]. The front air fuel sensor and inspected the PCV valve have not been checked [to my knowledge]; the wheel alignment is spot on [checked/adjusted twice in 3 years] and the tire pressure is checked at least 2x/month.
2] I recognize that every make and model vehicle has probably had oil consumption issues, but I’m just surprised that such a modern vehicle consumes so much oil. I’ve had 2 Honda Civics, 2 BMWs, 3 Mercedes Benz, and 5 Volvos. Not one of those vehicles [even ones with 4-5 times the milage] have had issues with oil consumption. And several of those cars had turbos. I’m not saying these other brands are devoid of oil consumption, but this is a very new “concept” to me. Even friends with early 2000s WRXs have zero issues with oil consumption.
3] Every vehicle’s owner’s manual says “check the oil”, and I know it’s negligent to not check the oil, but on my car it’s mission critical. This will affect resale value. If I say to the next owner: “check the oil once a week and every fill-up on a long trip” that screams “problem”. I have to stress, that I’m meticulous about maintenance on this vehicle – a mechanic would be proud!
4] I don’t own an F350, I was being facetious, but it sometimes feels like I’m driving an F350
I’m also aware that AWD vehicles use more fuel – that’s fairly obvious. I just find it surprising sometimes given how small the vehicle is. I get about 19 MPG and that’s driving cautiously. I was just whining a bit! Fuel is spendy up here in Canada.
Besides switching back to a Castrol GTX blend, what else would you recommend? I live in a pretty mild climate, but spend some time up in the mountains. A heavier weight oil perhaps? I dunno. I love Subarus, they’re solid, safe, fun to drive, but this oil consumption bugs me. Perhaps my only option is to buy oil in bulk and just live with it.
Using 5w40 can cut down on oil consumption, if GTX does not work than most likely for what ever reason the most plausible situation is the oil rings just never expanded and broke in properly, or your fuel is very diluted due to how you use it.
You can try different oil, most of it actually all comes from the same refiners, its just the additive packages that are unique to the brand, and its whats in those additives that can help prevent dilution.
the PCV is so over looked that the orifice could be partially stuck open, before we had cars with adaptive strategy they would run poorly like this, but in this age they will not and the PCV is one of those forgotten items. Id start there and switch to another brand of blend and maybe 5w40, but that depends on the climate also.
Heres the thing, so many dont know they’re car uses oil until its to late. I just had to help explain all of this to someone who is a friend of a Subaru customer with a 2011 Toyota that uses 1.1 to 1.3 quarts every 1000 miles, Toyota doesn’t want to do anything for her until its a little higher than that, they even have a TSB that we reviewed, thats why its so fresh in my head.
Ive helped some customers/engines Decrease oil consumption but if its oil control ring clearance thats the culprit there is no hope other than a re-ring and the # 1 cause of this is poor break in which may be worse to hear for some.
Justin
Justin
While reading through all of the comments on oil consumption issues with Subaru engines, I noticed one interesting thing. Most of the people who have sent you emails have owned different vehicles from various manufacturers. Oil consumption between normal oil change interval of 3000 miles was not noted on the dipstick but on Subaru engines it was. Seems strange to me that almost all Subaru owners complain of oil consumption while in other vehicles it can occur but only in isolated cases. I understand that all engines use oil, that is just common sense.But on most vehicles if you change the oil at 3000 mile intervals you should NOT have to add oil. On Subaru’s it seems like it is mandatory. I also agree with you that the vast majority of people don’t check their oil as frequently as they should but if you have owned 7 or 8 vehicles previously and none of them have needed oil between oil changes and then you buy a Subaru and don’t check oil like you did with your other vehicles, you are going to have big problems. Also in your answer to Mike, you strongly suggest using Castrol GTX 5W30 and changing at 3000 miles to see if oil consumption improves. Then you state that you should never use a fully synthetic oil in an engine that is consuming oil as they are not better for dilution factor and burn away as a result. But Subaru states that you MUST use 0W-20 fully synthetic oil in the FB engine to ensure warranty coverage. Sounds to me that even you are finally conceding that there is an oil consumption issue with this engine. I realize that working on Subaru is your bread and butter but be honest with us and tell us the truth. Subaru HAS a real problem with oil consumption in this engine and 0W-20 oil which has the viscosity of water is just magnifying the problem. Do you think that Subaru will come up with a real solution to this problem? A stop gap temporary solution might be changing the viscosity of the oil used in this engine. I look forward to your response.
Melvin,
People come here and try to use me as a pissing post or rant vacuum. Others need some advice and are actually willing to receive said advice knowing they are probably better at what they do than I, and realizing I am better at what I do than they.
1. Each reply I give is about that situation, so when I tell someone to use 5w30 Castrol synthetic blend it was because they were driving a car that did not require 0w20 Indemitsu oil. Such as a Forester with 105k (be kind of hard to have done that already with the FB) Or the gentleman using Mobil one to who knows what kind of interval, neither of the two Subaru’s in this situation were designed with synthetic in mind, the synthetic became ingrained in their mind by a commercial. Its about replies to there questions, about the car they own. Please dont try and read a post to one Subaru Owner and think somehow it applies to anything other than just that situation.
2. We have many customers that DO NOT have any oil consumption issues at all and some that do. Guess what? The cars are used differently, kind of like walking up a hill feels different than walking on a flat surface to your body the way a car is used will affect its needs.
All cars use oil, I dont need to concede anything, I’ve said it from the start of may carrer in the 80′s. What I have tried to explain on the current Impreza, is depending on how YOU use it it may consume oil at a higher than desired rate for the driver but within a parameter specified as normal by Subaru, it may continue to do so only until the engine is properly broken in which is taking longer on the 2.0l with CVT trans than on models in the past, or it may continue to use oil at a higher than desired rate until that customer decides a car that needs oil is a inconvenience to their way of life and trade it in for the new owner who actually drives the wheels off of it, it then stops using oil and they think its the greatest car ever.
Welcome to the car industry where it seems its perfect is the only answer, if you think its about Subaru guess again and google ANY car + oil consumption and let me know which ones dont show up.
The issue is, there is no one like me helping Toyota owners through the problems they are having, or Lexus or Chevy Or Mercedes, OR Mazda, OR Ford, Or you get my point, as a result, rants are only found on car owners forums and followup information also posted by car owners, you know the OMG your car shouldn’t like use oil, mine doesn’t. The pros are on IATN. Being a member of IATN and having many friends in the industry who dont work on Subaru’s I can tell you that every car maker has an issue like this with some of their cars. Every car company has an oil consumption policy, everyone!
Again, I will say this hopefully someone somewhere will have a light bulb go off. If your last car was say a Ford and it didn’t use a drop of oil, that doesn’t mean someone, somewhere else with the exact same car didn’t have just the opposite experience!
Just because you had one that didn’t use oil doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t check the oil in the one you have now and I can only speed when there isn’t a cop around.
Anytime you allow yourself to think you know something you do not, you are almost always going to learn the hard way that you were wrong.
Subaru may at some point have to address concerns raised by drivers, do not expect a redesign, or different oil, instead expect a letter trying to clarify whats already in the maintenance booklet.
The first Fb engine equipped car I had seen was in the Forester, and that car belongs to a customer of ours, it did not have the CVT trans and doesn’t use any real oil in-between oil changes, the next one belongs to one of my family members who bought a 2012 Impreza at the same time a friend in a business networking group bought theirs, both complained the car did not get the advertised fuel economy and were angry, I know that also one used some oil, fast forward almost one year later and fuel economy is right where it should be and the oil consumption has subsided but not until I told both of them to go drive it, quit just commuting.
Can I say everyone will have this experience, no but some will and I think its important to understand that.
I always tell you guys the truth, always, most of you just dont want to hear it and as such never do.
Justin
Justin
Thanks for your reply. I didn’t come here to rant and apologize if it came across that way. I came to your website looking for advice. I appreciate all of the time that you take to answer people’s questions and all of the comments regarding your service is top notch. I think that I am like alot of people who are vehicle shopping. A person goes on the Internet and tries to gather all the information that they can on the vehicles that they are interested in to avoid future problems. I am considering both the Outback and Forester which both use the FB engine. It sounds like Subaru has solved the Head Gasket issue with a semi-closed deck and improved head gasket. But on alot of Subaru owner’s forums, it seems like quite a few of owners are complaining about oil consumption in the FB engine. That is why I wrote my previous email to you. If a person is going to spend $30,000 for a new vehicle, they want to be confident in it’s design and reliability.
So in your expert opinion, from what you have seen and feedback from your customers,the new FB engine doesn’t consume more oil than competitor’s engines?
I look forward to your reply as the “oil consumption issue” is the only thing holding me back from buying a new 2014 Subaru Forester. Thanks again for your help and keep up the good work. Your time and efforts answering our questions are really appreciated Justin!!!
Toyota Has issued a few TSB’s about oil consumption the last one was in 2012. There is a very well known one that came out in 2011 that affects a large number of cars.
Ford as well, same for Honda, I am sure I could list more.
Most of them state that oil consumption of 1 quart within 1200 miles is considered normal and it can be, it doesn’t mean there is a mechanical deficiency if it uses more than a quart in 1200 miles it would be considered abnormal by most car makers and a warranty claim would be started at that time.
I cant say this enough, you may or may not use oil in any new car you buy, if its considered abnormal it will be repaired under warranty, if its considered to be in what that car maker states is a acceptable range there would not and it will be up to you to add oil here and there.
Justin
I am having problems with my 2010 subaru forester 2.5 using 2 quarts of oil to 3500-4000 miles. I’ve had subaru due an oil consumtion test but they said it was all normal. They tried telling me I wasen’t changing oil right and wasen’t checking it right. That I wasen’t filling it all the way full. So I’ve been letting sub. change oil and service. On this last oil change we had 3500 miles on oil change and my wife smelled oil burning, so she checked it. There wasen’t none on the stick. It took 2 Quarts to fill. I was told today that it was 900 miles over service and it was my fault. I thaught that with part-syn. oil you could go 5000 miles. Guess not?? We’re going to do a nother oil consumtion test, we’ll see this time. But on the way home from the shop I smelled burning oil the hole way home. Got in the drive way looked under the hood thinking it was from them changing oil and spilling oil. I found all the smoke was comming from the passenger side of the motor, on the exaust below the timing belt cover. I couldn,t see any oil leaking or dripping. The underneath of motor is dry. Any help would be great!!
Hi Tim,
SO you need to identify at what mileage from oil change it starts to consume oil one. Then yes you do need to consider changing it every 3000 miles and use blend. It may in fact be that it only starts to use oil closer to the 3000 mile from last service mark.
The smell could be form the oil change service as the oil filter is very close to the exhaust, but I don’t now that with out seeing it.
Justin
Thanks for the info. and I will keep better track of the oil from now on. But we’re still smelling burnt oil, with no oil leaks. Thanks again!!
A sloppy oil change can create a smell that takes a long tine to go away.
Also small leaks can create smells long before it shows up on the ground.
I bought my 1999 Forrester with 124000km, my head gasket started leaking at about 130000km so i was losing a fair bit of oil but always making sure it was at a good level i would check it everyday. About 140000km my clutch started so i decided to bite the bullet and got my clutch both head gaskets and timing belt. I was also forced to get plugs because the oil went right up which i didn’t realize at the time because i never pulled a plug to look. Anyway i spent alot of money and was hoping after i did this i wouldn’t have to use as much oil as when i had a blown headgasket. I am wondering if you could maybe give me some advice on what would be a good oil over the 5w30. the guy who did the gaskets and clutch said that my rings looked good but there was a lot of carbon built up which i believe could have been from the lady who owned it previous to me who only put 120000km on it over 11 years putting around.
last question i believe that the way that the boxer engine sits that oil slips past the rings when you park and then gets blown out the ass end when you start it im wondering if this is true does this even happen if the rings are brand-new? O ya also would synthetic even be worth it if the oil slipping past the rings is the case because it seems like the thinner the oil the better it will get through. Thanks for your time
You can use a 5w40 blend depending on the climate.
so why does the service techsometimes put down 5 qts other times 6 qts?
Thats a question for them isn’t it?
why cant I find the oil for my 2011 forester 0w20 at auto part stores?the dealer charged $8 a guart.I bought 2 Qts so that I can add when it uses alittle.also what should the dealer do at the 30,000 mile. they told me the differential fluid was bad both front and back. I am a very easy driver not fast or hard on my car I drive 50 miles a day to work all highway?thanksRita
How long do you think the Diff fluid should last? We suggest it every 30k as well as do most dealers, actually probably 90%.
You need to ask your parts store why they don’t stock the oil for your car. The oil is sold by Subaru and made by Indemitsu as it is for Toyota, and other Japanese car companies as well. Indemitsu is not going to compete for shelf space at a parts store, that’s reserved for the non professional products.
Justin
Hi,
Saw this thread and hope I can ask a related question!
I am thinking of buying a 2005 forester 2.5 turbo that has about 150000 kilometers (94000 miles) on the meter. The car is in excellent condition, and is properly maintained and all.
The only hazzle is that the seller tells me that it consumes just above 1 litres (appx 1.3 gallons) of oil every 10000 kilometers (about 6250 miles). My experience from my 2007 2.0 Legacy is absolutely zero oil consumption, and thats why I worry a bit.
What do you say – would you consider this perfectly normal for this engine?
Br
Petter Alexanderson, Sweden
Hello Peter,
Turbos will by their very nature use more oil than a N/A engine. If you do buy it however I would increase the oil change intervals if you don’t want to buy a Turbo and possibly an engine for it. I have never been to Sweden so I am not very familiar with the typical drive cycles, temperatures, use etc. to really have a complete picture of what the proper intervals are, but with Turbos I get nervous over 4000 miles due to the size of the filter and the dilution factor.
Hope that helps
Justin
Thanks it helps!
Normal temperature I would assume similar to northern us, ranging from -30 to plus 20 celsius. Typical driving longer ranges, 80-100 miles and above.
Big thanks for the answer – will follow your advice regardless of which car I buy!
Br
Petter
I burn one quart every 2000 miles. Got lawyer used lemon law got $6000 settlement
Sounds kind of fishy to me.
What state allows that? The lemon laws don’t allow for monetary settlement typically, they force a buy back. Id be interested to see the court documents to see what argument your attorney used and if Subaru has plans to appeal.
Justin
Hi Justin,
My dad’s 2006 Outback 2.5i is up to 254,000 original miles, it is a great car. Recently it went 4,300 miles on Formula Shell Synthetic oil 5w30.(i normally change the oil more frequently, with 5w40 rotella t6. However my dad picked up the oil)
when i drained the oil, it was unusually clean. i’ve done every oil change on this car since new, and this was the cleanest looking oil. it only used 1 quart in 3800 miles where it would normally go through a quart every 2k.
I am curious, have you heard of this before with this particular oil? I’m sure it could be other factors as well, but i keep the car well maintained.
As far as i know, the driving style and conditions were consistent on this oil change compared to others. A few weeks earlier i carefully ran 2 quarts of distilled water (already turned into steam with a steamer) through the intake at the throttle body at ~2600 rpms to clean some carbon, as the engine was pinging moderately on hills. This did eliminate the ping.
Excellent articles, i’m a regular on this site and have learned so much.
-Matt
Hi Matt,
The Carbon cleaning probably helped by creating less hot spots leading to better combustion, this coupled with synthetic oil most likely lowered the oil temperature and thus decreased the consumption, that will tell you that this engine may have components that are worn and when they expand the greatest the oil use increases. Best guess would be valve stem seals. Its alos possible that the additive package is better suited to the use.
Hope that helps
Justin
Hi Justin,
I truly appreciate the time that you have taken responding to the previous posts. It really has helped me understand what could be going on with my car. I’ve had many cars in the past and have always checked the oil even though I’ve never really had to add much.
I have a 2005 Saab 92X (Saabaru) with 118K and only recently have I been having some problems with oil disappearing. After reading your posts I wonder (hope) if it’s the PCV valve. For the past 500 miles I’ve noticed (aside from burning a 1/2 quart of oil) that I smell a gas smell now and then (not often) and my gas mileage has been worse. I commute 70 miles/day. I may be and probably am crazy but also think the engine sounds a bit dieselly.
Should I be sidelining this car and taking the day off tomorrow to bring it in or is this something that I can continue to monitor until I have time to leave it at the mechanic? How would I know if it’s the PCV valve or something worse or just normal for a 118K 8Yr old vehicle?
Its possible the PCV is stuck, or the fuel mixture is rich and thus diluting the oil.
If you are noticing a change its better to be reactive.
Justin
Hi, Justin
My 2003 Forester with 130k mi uses oil at about a quart per 500 mi. Would this cause shortened catalytic converter life?
Thanks!
If the convertor becomes restricted with Carbon build up as a result then yes.
Justin,
I putting together an order for parts since our 2000 Legacy wagon’s headgasket finally started to weep at 175,000 miles. It owes us nothing and has been a great car. I really like it though and am willing to spend a little time and money to keep it around. I had the heads milled, cleaned up and had the valves checked and lapped. The machine shop went ahead and installed Fel-Pro valve seals (FPG SS72814). Can you speak specifically to the quality of these seals? If they are an inferior part, I am ready to add your seals to my order but if they are an acceptable part, I’d rather not go through the time and trouble of switching out new, zero mile seals.
Thank you,
Anthony
Sorry Anthony I just would never uses any Felpro product on any Japanese import, that’s the only input I have, I cant speak to the Valve stem seals specifically.
We take out quite a few Felpro HG the ones that are Blue. This has gone on for as log as I have worked On Subaru Vehicles going all the way back to short lived HG repairs on the Loyales.
Maybe the Stem seals are better or just re-boxed?
Justin
Why not have Honda or some other company build the engines?
I have had 16 of those since 1980 and don’t even need to check the level between changes. I think this problem will stop a family member from getting a 2014 Forester. It Owner’s Manual actually say a quart every 1200 miles is OK.
Subaru has put this in bold print in the Oil Change section of the manual, but I bet they don’t disclose this during the sales process.
Its lot only the cost of the oil between changes, but my daughter does not want to have to keep oil in stock and mess with adding it.
Hi JP,
1. Google “Honda Oil Consumption issues” there are pages of posts even lawsuits because some use oil so bad the spark plugs foul! Just because you have had no issues does not mean that no one else did.
2. The companies that make the pistons, rings, bearings etc for Honda are the same companies that make them for Subaru.
The same rules about checking your oil will be found in the Honda Owners manual.
Checking oil is part of ownership, its also called teaching responsibility, I understand its a novel concept these days or considered inconvenient to some but the rules still apply.. Please tell me she at least checks the air in her tires or you do, so she is at least somewhat safe? Before the car was the horse and if you didn’t care for the horse it would not get you where you were going some horses could go days, some only an hour before needing water, food or rest, same rules apply to the car, some cars based on use may not use much oil in between oil changes some will use more than a quart some more than that, but the fact that the oil needs to be checked and topped off as needed does not change. This situation does not discriminate by the brand, only mechanical factors and use.
Best of luck
Justin
I think checking oil and other fluid levels, tire pressure, etc is expected of any vehicle owner, even though most don’t do it. I hope that those that don’t do any checks are purchasing the longest extended warranty option, offered by the manufacturer because they’re just asking for trouble. After reading this article, which is informative and fact based, I can’t believe that anyone would defend a car company who’s cars burn a quart of oil every 1500-3000 miles, inbetween oil changes… !
We get it, all cars burn oil, but 1 QUART every 1,500 to 3,000 MILES!!!! Come on. How much of a Subaru fanboy can you possibly be to say that this is normal, compared to other cars?
Hi John,
I am not sure how trying to present facts makes me a fan boy?
Any car can use oil, if you own a car that uses oil its the biggest piece of crap ever made and some let emotions overrule sound logic, For every Subaru vehicle in which someone is here or on another Forum complaining about oil usage there are just as many if not many more other makes and models with the same issue and a rant on another website, for every Subaru owner that has what they feel is excessive oil consumption there are many that don’t have the problem, Subaru just like every other car maker, will tell you one quart every 1000 miles is acceptable to them, any more would indicate a mechanical issue, this is not a Subaru thing its in every car makers owners manual.
WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND?
“We get it, all cars burn oil, but 1 QUART every 1,500 to 3,000 MILES!!!! Come on. How much of a Subaru fanboy can you possibly be to say that this is normal, compared to other cars?”
When I point out that other car companies have the same issue with using oil, does that make me a Honda Fan boy or still just a Subaru one or maybe, just maybe I am trying to explain some of the nuances that will never change with the internal combustion engine that may in fact be affecting one owner differently than the next. What part of every car company can and do make cars that use oil in between oil changes is so hard to get, do I need to show the world how to use google and maybe search for oh I don’t know Honda oil consumption issues? or Toyota oil consumption issues, or maybe VW, chevy Ford Dodge Kia shall I continue?
I am trying in vain obviously to explain whats considered acceptable in the industry, everyone is entitled to their opinion but telling me its not normal for some cars to use oil is just that an opinion and nothing based on facts.
Some days I question How I can live on the same planet as those who cant see past the end of their nose and look to see if oil consumption just might be something that every car company contends with?
If instead you would like to continue to believe Subaru is the only one who has oil consumption issues without really ever having a look I just don’t know what to say, please show me which one does not use oil, I am not looking for the “my 1996 Toyota doesn’t use oil”, I mean that after searching for drivers of the same vehicle you are unable to find not one single solitary rant on a owners forum complaining of oil use, until then I am here to tell you it does not exist.
When oil consumption gets to the point where the plugs foul its considered excessive by the entire industry, until its at that point its considered within a normal rate of consumption, if someone cant live with a car that uses oil and would like to own one that doesn’t they may have better luck with another car, that car may or may not use oil based on how they use it, but the potential for oil use exists in ALL car companies whats acceptable to you is your decision if its less than what the car maker determines is a warrant-able event.
Justin
I am done trying to explain this, no one gets it. Your right Oil use is only ever found in Subaru engines, all those other posts on other sites about other makes just are a conspiracy.
The difference is that when other engines are using that much oil, they’re defective. In Honda’s case, they supposedly tried to fix it with a software update and as a fallback plan, they were going to tell the owners that adding oil is normal. I’m not defending every other car company and targeting Subaru because of the oil consumption. You’re describing this problem as a normal occurrence that’s the fault of the owner for neglecting to check the oil level after every fillup. From what you’re saying, Subaru has designed the engine to consume this excess of oil. It’s essentially a design flaw or defect that they refuse to fix and claim it’s normal.
A friend of mine bought a Legacy last year and it’s consuming oil at a rate of about 1 quart per 1500-2000 miles. It’s been doing this since they bought it brand new. If this article was about Honda/Toyota/GM/Insert car company here, I would be saying the same thing.
Regardless, I was considering Subaru for my next vehicle, but no thanks. I guess I will try my luck with one of the other car companies whose vehicles I have never experienced consuming a quart of oil every 1,000 miles.
Wow
In black and white in every owners manual in virtually every car ever made it states to check the oil, at every fill up!
Best of luck, and Goodbye!
Hi Justin et al
Can I just say you have been extremely patient in reiterating the message that oil levels need to be checked and oil replaced to avoid dilution. Thank you for your time and advice and I have forwarded this thread on to some friends with oil consumption concerns. In regards to some posters saying that other marques do not have similar issues I will happily point out the 4.5ltr v8 diesel in the Toyota Landcruiser, where Toyota are basically telling owners to carry a few litres (similar to quarts) in the car at all times even on new examples. The GM Gen3 LS1 v8 is known to have high oil consumption from new. The Honda Integra was basically built to consume oil with one less oil containment ring used in its design. The 2.5ltr 5 cylinder motor in the Focus and Volvo also has seen some issues. And motorbikes are in general designed to sacrifice oil for the purpose of allowing less frictional losses at high engine speeds. In Australia just because we are upside down doesn’t mean our engines are defective. Oil consumption is indeed normal in engine operation and some designs or examples may use more than others I will accept. But it is not an issue isolated to GM, Ford or Subaru. And stories about the engine that never used oil are just half truths.
Thanks again for your patience with these nit pickers but also for bringing common sense into what is a costly and emotive topic: our cars.
Cheers
Nigel
Thanks for the kind words and your post. I truly needed to read something like this today!
Justin
Hi Justin…..I have a couple of acedemic questions for you about oil for my 2week old 2014 2.5i. I’m the same person who sucessfully used coolant conditioner on my 2002 head gasket issue to buy time till my new car arrived. I understand the that 0-20w oil and 5-20w oil only differ by the viscosity at start up… and that the bypass filter rating is only a concern when there’s enough sludge in the filter to trigger the bypass.
Would the use of 5-20 synthetic oil in the FB25 engine cause any consumption or other issues since it’s tuned for 0-20?
Would an aftermarket oil filter with a lower bypass pressure rating cause any issues?
Thanks so much for your time….
I would not suggest an aftermarket oil filter during the warranty period of 5 years 60k
Why take the chance?
As far as would a lower bypass cause a problem, it may force it into bypass sooner, the idea is to change the oil and pre bypass mode.
Justin
Justin, thanks for all of your advice. You’re absolutely correct – you can google “oil consumption” for any car manufacturer and you will get pages and pages of hits.
I have a 2007 Impreza with 187,000 km (just over 116,000 miles), so there is no warranty coverage. My driving is a mix of city and country, and I do not drive aggressively – in fact I tend to use cruise control whenever I can. I had the head gasket replaced by the local Subaru dealer 2 years ago, and the catalytic converter and clutch replaced a year ago by them, but have had no other issues.
The car used 2L after 2,000 km (owner’s manual says 1L after 2,000 km is normal). They recommended replacing the short-block assembly at a cost of over $5,000. I’m only looking for another 2-3 more years of driving from this vehicle, so I have to believe that simply adding a $5 litre of oil every 1,000 km is the more economical way to go. Am I missing something?
BTW, there are numerous oil additives on the market that claim to reduce oil consumption. Are any of them worth trying, or should I just switch from 5W30 to 5W40 oil?
Hello Terry,
I am on the add oil to it and wagon until it gets t a point where it either starts to foul the spark plugs or smokes profusely out of the exhaust.
You can try 5w40 and also maybe try Castrol or Kendall brands if you can locate them.
As far as additives Ive never really seen anything that works, and honesty the additives as an experiment can get expensive.
Hope that helps
Justin